Reed: Courts must hold Trump to Constitution

The first few weeks of the Trump administration have been a whirlwind, raising alarm among Democrats and pleasing supporters of the president. U.S. Sen. Jack Reed sat down to discuss Trump’s initiatives and how Democrats are responding. 

Here are highlights from the interview.

On how the delegation is responding: 

Sen. Reed: “I think the delegation is working extraordinarily well. On my own sake, I led the effort to prevent Secretary Hegseth from being named Secretary of Defense for reasons that at least convinced several other Republicans to join us, the only time I’ve seen a real break in their ranks. And we sent a signal, I hope, to the president that his appointees, his nominees can’t be superficial. They have to be people of competence, character, experience. And Senator Whitehouse has been extremely diligent with respect to his role in nominations and other aspects too. We’re in a position right now where, based on our constitutional system, the courts are the best form of relief. The president’s arguably breaking the law in many cases, and as a result, it’s the courts that must declare that and impose the proper sanction.”

On the worst-case scenario until the mid-terms: 

Sen. Reed: “Well, the worst case is frankly creating such institutional turmoil that the government really can’t function. And there is a theory that that’s one of the goals of President Trump. He likes chaos, he thrives on it, and it allows him to be unchecked, which he likes, and also to make money, which he likes. So that’s the case where this will not be focused really on reforming the government and certainly not by abiding by the law but more on self-aggrandizement and self-promotion. That would be terrible because it would lead, I think, to an aggregation of power in the White House that would be a constitutional threat …. One aspect of this too is, this is being seen throughout the world — so America is being judged now, not as a reliable, steady partner, but as this erratic function. One day you have USAID helping health care centers in a country, and the next day they’re gone. What does that say about the durability and the stability of the United States?”

On how Politico described a loss of relevance for the Senate:

Sen. Reed: “Well, there is a very significant and real danger because our constitutional role is advice and consent. And frankly, my suspicion is that many of the people that voted for these individuals [such as Tulsi Gabbard and Robert F. Kennedy Jr.] had no confidence in their ability to do the job. And as a result, the Senate, I think, stepped back from its constitutional role, and that’s unfortunate. The closest we got was Hegseth. It’s the first, the second time, I believe, that a vice president ever had to vote to break a tie for a Cabinet appointee.”

On the ability of courts to prevent Trump’s excesses: 

Sen. Reed: “Well, I think the lower courts are doing that right now, and it’s people who’ve been appointed by Republican presidents and Democratic presidents. They just understand this is clearly against the law. When it gets up to the Supreme Court, there it gets to be a little more complicated …. I think their concern is going to be not only what’s the right thing to do, but will they be recognized and will that judgment be enforced by the president. And again, Trump’s behavior is trying to send signals even to the court that ‘you have no power. I have all the power.’ That concerns me, and it should concern everyone.”

On whether there’s something to Trump’s talk about cutting government waste: 

Sen. Reed: “Well, it’s somewhat ironic. They are proposing to literally gut the IRS and a great deal of that fraud comes through the income tax system. People not paying their taxes – and not the working people because it’s deducted from your pay – but people who have high-level incomes and find incredibly complicated tax schemes. And yet he’s going to take away all that money from the IRS to go out and enforce what is probably, in many respects, one of the major forms of lost revenue to the federal government or misspent revenue. So, this is not about cracking down on corruption. This is about cracking down on his political enemies or people he perceives as his enemies. It’s also about trying to eliminate, in large part, the federal workforce, which for many, many years has served with great dedication and great diligence.

On the cumulative effect if Trump succeeds in eliminating or greatly curtailing government agencies, significantly downsizing the CIA and replacing thousands of Civil Service employees in the federal government with loyalists: 

Sen. Reed: “It will be a disaster. Let me just give you an example. Cutting off foreign aid: Right now the Israelis and the Lebanese forces are trying to maintain the cease-fire in Lebanon, and we cut off all foreign assistance to Lebanon. We should be actually putting more resources in there to stabilize that government, which for the first time in a long time is a non-Hezbollah government. And that would hopefully maintain the cease-fire. In addition to that, Trump has said through his Cabinet he’s going to eliminate the Cybersecurity Commission, in the Homeland Security Department. That’s the agency that goes after disinformation, particularly from foreign countries like Russia, and China, and Iran. That’s going to flood the airwaves with incredible disinformation that will confuse and conflict Americans. Then he’s also stopped enforcing sanctions on Russia and their oligarchs, and that’s sending a signal to Putin, ‘Hey, you know, I’ll help you. You know, give me a face-saving deal in the Ukraine.’ So, after a while, if you don’t have an intelligence capacity, you can’t anticipate what’s going to happen, you can’t react.”

To listen to the interview: The Public's Radio RI PBS.